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Post by Cepha on Jun 6, 2009 12:35:49 GMT -5
I'm not really opposed to telling children about homosexuality. I know I will if they ask. Children shouldn't even be taught about heterosexuality in school. However, "when" my daughters asked me about it, I explained it to them. That's the parent's job...not the schools' in my opinion. |
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Post by emily445455 on Jun 6, 2009 12:40:20 GMT -5
eh, I would agree....but there are some lousy parents out there. Sometimes the schools have to step in so the kids know at least something and are less likely to tease the children with two mommies or two daddies.
But the schools step over the line when they say things like "it is ok" or "normal". They should just say it is different...and leave it at that.
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Post by watchman on Jun 6, 2009 12:45:59 GMT -5
Because Jesus returns at the end of the Tribulation and Jesus hasn't returned yet. Come on cepha you not really as dumb as you act are you? How do you know "this" isn't the tribulation we're going through right now? War, abortion, "legal" homosexual unions, the poor being allowed to starve while the rich and sinful prosper, etc... [PS When it comes to scripture, I don't pretend to be "smart", I'm an ignoramous] I don't know that we are not in the Tribulation but I know it wasn't 70 ad because Christ hasn't returned. The Great Tribulation that Jesus refers to in Matthew 24 is the 42 month long rule of the anti christ in which Jesus returns at the end of to sset up His Millenniual Kingdom. P.S. you sure act like a know it all from where I sit. |
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Post by watchman on Jun 6, 2009 12:49:49 GMT -5
Now, show me (since you said that The Catholic Church teaches this) where the "doctrinal" (in The Catechism) teaching is? ;D I cannot bring myself to care what the catechism says. You staed in an eariler post you just heard ofg this and you really didn't know much about it. You have shown that to be abundantly clear, but it would be wise to know what your talking about before you atert blabering. You find for yourself what the catechism teaches on the restrainer, and then if you like you can post it, not that I really care. |
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Post by alfie on Jun 6, 2009 16:33:23 GMT -5
I copied this paragraph about the restrainer from another web-site.
It too was widely held in the early church, being found in the writings of Theodoret, Theodore of Mopsuestia, and Chrysostom. The view may reflect apostolic teaching. Moreover, it would seem that a person is required to restrain a person, and a supernatural one to restrain this man of lawlessness who is motivated by Satan himself. Finally, this view best accounts for the change in gender between verses 6 and 7. Verse 6 uses a neuter to identify the restrainer, most likely a reference to the Greek noun for spirit, pneuma. The change in verse 7 to the masculine is a reference to the personality of the Holy Spirit. Thus, the most likely reference is to the Holy Spirit, for even if the restraining of evil is through human government, ultimately that is only possible through the power given it by the Holy Spirit.
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Post by watchman on Jun 6, 2009 17:00:28 GMT -5
The restrainer is not the Holy Spirit plain and simple. The only reason people believe it is is because of the dispensational, pretrib false doctrine.
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Post by cradlecathlic27 on Jun 7, 2009 16:15:58 GMT -5
I agree that it should be taught by the parents....all morals and values, and goals should start at the home! Parents need to teach their children manners...which alot dont have anymore!
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Post by emily445455 on Jun 7, 2009 17:39:22 GMT -5
Defintly agree with the manners!!!
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Post by Ramon on Jun 7, 2009 22:12:45 GMT -5
I copied this paragraph about the restrainer from another web-site. It too was widely held in the early church, being found in the writings of Theodoret, Theodore of Mopsuestia, and Chrysostom. The view may reflect apostolic teaching. Moreover, it would seem that a person is required to restrain a person, and a supernatural one to restrain this man of lawlessness who is motivated by Satan himself. Finally, this view best accounts for the change in gender between verses 6 and 7. Verse 6 uses a neuter to identify the restrainer, most likely a reference to the Greek noun for spirit, pneuma. The change in verse 7 to the masculine is a reference to the personality of the Holy Spirit. Thus, the most likely reference is to the Holy Spirit, for even if the restraining of evil is through human government, ultimately that is only possible through the power given it by the Holy Spirit. What is "it"? Saint John Chrysostom did not believe it was the Holy Spirit. The restrainer is not the Holy Spirit, and you can't prove it. It is a opinion not a actual teaching in Scriptures. The fact that many will get "save" in the Tribulation prove that the Holy Spirit (who convicts unbelievers of there sins) is not taken out before the Tribulation. You only believe such teaching to justify your unscriptural teaching of Pre-Tribulation Rapture. Christ taught that the Rapture will not occur until after the Tribulation, at the end of age (Matthew 13). You can not give any Scripture to prove your unscriptura doctrinel, only texts that you have taken out of context to teach a Rapture of the Church, supposedly before the Tribulation (i.e., your poorly reference of Revelation 3:10). In IC.XC, Ramon |
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Post by Ramon on Jun 7, 2009 22:18:40 GMT -5
According to the Navarre Bible, a highly respected Catholic Commentary, some believe the restrainer is Saint Michael the Archangel. Granted, it is not doctrine in the Roman Church (as far as I know the Catholic Church has not proclaim any interpretation concerning the Restrainer), but it is a held opinion within the Roman Church.
I believe this interpretation is a better interpretation given the facts I wrote earlier.
In IC.XC,
Ramon
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Post by teresahrc on Jun 8, 2009 9:51:29 GMT -5
To be honest, I think the "pre-trib rapture" idea came about because a bunch of people were terrified of suffering. So they got some teachers to tell them what their "itching ears" wanted to hear. It doesn't matter to me because it doesn't change how we are to live our lives, and yes, the Christian life is a life of suffering. We are to take up our cross DAILY and follow Jesus.
If anyone is to be killed by the sword, then by the sword he will be slain! Bring it on, I would love to be a martyr!
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Post by Cepha on Jun 8, 2009 10:27:27 GMT -5
The restrainer is not the Holy Spirit plain and simple. The only reason people believe it is is because of the dispensational, pretrib false doctrine. Nope...in fact, no such thing as "The Restrainer" is even mentioned in scripture. The Scripture only says one thing...some"thing" does the restraining, not some"one". It (that which does the restraining) is a "what", not a who or whom. It seems to be The Law (which makes sense. The Law restrains us from sinning).  |
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Post by teresahrc on Jun 8, 2009 10:34:54 GMT -5
I'm starting to think maybe it is the archangel. Remember in Jude when Michael was disputing with Satan about the body of Moses?
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Post by alfie on Jun 8, 2009 10:40:51 GMT -5
To be honest, I think the "pre-trib rapture" idea came about because a bunch of people were terrified of suffering. So they got some teachers to tell them what their "itching ears" wanted to hear. It doesn't matter to me because it doesn't change how we are to live our lives, and yes, the Christian life is a life of suffering. We are to take up our cross DAILY and follow Jesus. If anyone is to be killed by the sword, then by the sword he will be slain! Bring it on, I would love to be a martyr! Bring it on? Killed by the sword? You are more than amusing Teresa. In an earlier post you were whining about how tough your life is and yet you have the audacity to brag about being a martyr during the tribulation? Just remember you won't be able to get food stamps and medicaid. |
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Post by teresahrc on Jun 8, 2009 10:45:37 GMT -5
To be honest, I think the "pre-trib rapture" idea came about because a bunch of people were terrified of suffering. So they got some teachers to tell them what their "itching ears" wanted to hear. It doesn't matter to me because it doesn't change how we are to live our lives, and yes, the Christian life is a life of suffering. We are to take up our cross DAILY and follow Jesus. If anyone is to be killed by the sword, then by the sword he will be slain! Bring it on, I would love to be a martyr! Bring it on? Killed by the sword? You are more than amusing Teresa. In an earlier post you were whining about how tough your life is and yet you have the audacity to brag about being a martyr during the tribulation? Just remember you won't be able to get food stamps and medicaid. Beg your pardon? I wasn't "whining" about my life, I was whining about the Republican agenda. (I showed my story to contradict the typical thought that people on welfare are lazy etc) I'm not bragging about anything. I already know I'm a pathetic loser. Thanks for reminding me though. |
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Post by Cepha on Jun 8, 2009 10:48:04 GMT -5
According to the Navarre Bible, a highly respected Catholic Commentary, some believe the restrainer is Saint Michael the Archangel. Granted, it is not doctrine in the Roman Church (as far as I know the Catholic Church has not proclaim any interpretation concerning the Restrainer), but it is a held opinion within the Roman Church. I believe this interpretation is a better interpretation given the facts I wrote earlier. In IC.XC, Ramon Thank you for clearing that up Ramon...oh! And THANK YOU for defending me on Christian Forums when I was being slandered over there! You are a true friend and despite our 3% differences in doctrinal beliefs, I'd commune with you anyday bro! ;D |
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Post by alfie on Jun 8, 2009 10:54:08 GMT -5
According to the Navarre Bible, a highly respected Catholic Commentary, some believe the restrainer is Saint Michael the Archangel. Granted, it is not doctrine in the Roman Church (as far as I know the Catholic Church has not proclaim any interpretation concerning the Restrainer), but it is a held opinion within the Roman Church. I believe this interpretation is a better interpretation given the facts I wrote earlier. In IC.XC, Ramon The restrainer would be restraining lawlesness in the whole world until the time of delusion. Michael is the protector of Israel not the entire world. The prophet Daniel experienced a vision. In the vision, an angel identifies Michael as the protector of Israel (10:13, 21). Later in the vision (12:1), Daniel is informed that Michael will stand for Israel during the tribulation to come. There is no further mention of Michael in the Hebrew Bible. |
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Post by watchman on Jun 8, 2009 10:58:44 GMT -5
According to the Navarre Bible, a highly respected Catholic Commentary, some believe the restrainer is Saint Michael the Archangel. Granted, it is not doctrine in the Roman Church (as far as I know the Catholic Church has not proclaim any interpretation concerning the Restrainer), but it is a held opinion within the Roman Church. I believe this interpretation is a better interpretation given the facts I wrote earlier. In IC.XC, Ramon The restrainer would be restraining lawlesness in the whole world until the time of delusion. Michael is the protector of Israel not the entire world. The prophet Daniel experienced a vision. In the vision, an angel identifies Michael as the protector of Israel (10:13, 21). Later in the vision (12:1), Daniel is informed that Michael will stand for Israel during the tribulation to come. There is no further mention of Michael in the Hebrew Bible. Michael is the protector of God people which includes the Church, and will do anything God commands him to do. |
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Post by alfie on Jun 8, 2009 10:59:18 GMT -5
According to the Navarre Bible, a highly respected Catholic Commentary, some believe the restrainer is Saint Michael the Archangel. Granted, it is not doctrine in the Roman Church (as far as I know the Catholic Church has not proclaim any interpretation concerning the Restrainer), but it is a held opinion within the Roman Church. I believe this interpretation is a better interpretation given the facts I wrote earlier. In IC.XC, Ramon Thank you for clearing that up Ramon...oh! And THANK YOU for defending me on Christian Forums when I was being slandered over there! You are a true friend and despite our 3% differences in doctrinal beliefs, I'd commune with you anyday bro! ;D In other words Ramon is saying the restrainer could be the Holy Spirit. |
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Post by Cepha on Jun 8, 2009 11:04:22 GMT -5
To be honest, I think the "pre-trib rapture" idea came about because a bunch of people were terrified of suffering. So they got some teachers to tell them what their "itching ears" wanted to hear. It doesn't matter to me because it doesn't change how we are to live our lives, and yes, the Christian life is a life of suffering. We are to take up our cross DAILY and follow Jesus. If anyone is to be killed by the sword, then by the sword he will be slain! Bring it on, I would love to be a martyr! I don't stress it anyway...it's out of our hands. Let Jesus do His work while we "work out" our own salvation! ;D  |
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