|
|
John 6
Dec 19, 2008 16:48:01 GMT -5
Post by Reformedalt on Dec 19, 2008 16:48:01 GMT -5
Amen! Can I count you in as an advocate for The Eucharist then? You didn't seem to read my post. In light of verse 39, Jesus states that whoever drinks his blood and eats his flesh shall never perish. The RCC teaches that those who eat the host every Sunday for their entire lives can fall into mortal sin and go to Hell. This cannot be if Jesus states that whoever drinks his blood and eats his flesh shall never perish, parallel to verse 39. |
|
|
|
John 6
Dec 19, 2008 16:51:27 GMT -5
Post by Reformedalt on Dec 19, 2008 16:51:27 GMT -5
When James mentioned demons, he was stating that even they believed in Jesus, so they weren't saved by their faith. Right? Faith is faith is faith is faith. I never read where there was a distinction between human or demonic faith. Fact is, I never heard a Protestant even say that. To believe in Christ is not valued by who does the believing. Again, you didn't read my post. Paul defines "Faith" differently than James. When Paul teaches Sola Fide in Romans 4, he states that whoever does not work, but believes in him who justifies the ungodly, he reckons his faith as righteousness. Paul's "faith" includes the work of regeneration in the heart of the sinner. When James defines faith, he defines it as the mere assent to the existance of God made by the demons themselves. This "faith" produces no regeneration. That is why works complete this "faith", and they justify us. |
|
|
|
John 6
Dec 19, 2008 16:52:51 GMT -5
Post by Reformedalt on Dec 19, 2008 16:52:51 GMT -5
Actually, faith is not a requirement for Salvation. That only applies to Christians. Read Romans 2 where non-believers are justified to God because they live His law which is written on their hearts. It is required from all those who hear of Christ, even if they are not Christian. |
|
reformed
New Member
Sola Deo Gloria
Posts: 6
|
John 6
Dec 19, 2008 17:25:23 GMT -5
Post by reformed on Dec 19, 2008 17:25:23 GMT -5
For what its worth, I consider Catholicism Christian, but I strongly disagree with its soteriology and epistemology.
|
|
|
|
John 6
Dec 20, 2008 2:14:08 GMT -5
Post by cradlecathlic27 on Dec 20, 2008 2:14:08 GMT -5
Those are some big words!  |
|
|
|
John 6
Dec 20, 2008 16:27:37 GMT -5
Post by Cepha on Dec 20, 2008 16:27:37 GMT -5
You didn't seem to read my post. In light of verse 39, Jesus states that whoever drinks his blood and eats his flesh shall never perish. And I agree with that. Of course since Salvation isn't Guaranteed. Judas ate Jesus' flesh and drank His blood. Is Judas "saved"? But, you forget, that one must do it in a proper state as Paul would go on to reveal later... 1 Corinthians 11: 27 Wherefore whosoever shall eat this bread, and drink this cup of the Lord, unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord. 28 But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of that bread, and drink of that cup. 29 For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body. If one is saved forever after receiving communion, why the need to examine their conscience? How can they become "unworthy" afterward? |
|
|
|
John 6
Dec 20, 2008 16:35:23 GMT -5
Post by Cepha on Dec 20, 2008 16:35:23 GMT -5
Again, you didn't read my post. Paul defines "Faith" differently than James. (And I says this with all due respect)...Faith is faith is faith is faith. Paul never taught "Sola Fide". In fact, the only time that that term ever appears in scripture is when James literally states that one is "not" saved by "faith alone". It would help if you could provide a specific scripture with that term? Here's mine... James 2:24 "You see that a man is justified by works and not by faith alone." I don't know about you, but that sounds like a "work" to me. I kind of take the his words "as" written when he clearly says (and in context): James 2:24 "You see that a man is justified by works and not by faith alone." He was using the comparison to demons to show that even Satan knows that Jesus is The Messiah, but that won't save him. What about those "saved" believers that Jesus sent to hell? Matthew 25: 44"They also will answer, 'Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?' 45"He will reply, 'I tell you the truth, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.' 46"Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life." |
|
|
|
John 6
Dec 20, 2008 16:38:11 GMT -5
Post by Cepha on Dec 20, 2008 16:38:11 GMT -5
Actually, faith is not a requirement for Salvation. That only applies to Christians. Read Romans 2 where non-believers are justified to God because they live His law which is written on their hearts. It is required from all those who hear of Christ, even if they are not Christian. Really? When did the Samaritan woman "hear" of Christ when Jesus said she showed faith? John 4 25The woman said, "I know that Messiah" (called Christ) "is coming. When he comes, he will explain everything to us." 26Then Jesus declared, "I who speak to you am he." (The Samaritans didn't believe in the same God that The Jews did...her "Messiah" was different) |
|
|
|
John 6
Dec 20, 2008 16:44:20 GMT -5
Post by Cepha on Dec 20, 2008 16:44:20 GMT -5
For what its worth, I consider Catholicism Christian, but I strongly disagree with its soteriology and epistemology. Thank you for that...that's truly Christian of you. You don't have to agree with us to state truth. God bless you bro. Pax |
|
|
|
John 6
Dec 20, 2008 16:44:40 GMT -5
Post by Cepha on Dec 20, 2008 16:44:40 GMT -5
Those are some big words!  |
|
|
|
John 6
Jan 2, 2009 19:02:06 GMT -5
Post by watchman on Jan 2, 2009 19:02:06 GMT -5
How about we move on and discuss John 6:48-59! Or even John 6:66. This verse clearly shows that there were some that had once chose to walk with Christ that turned from Him and decided to no longer walk with Him. We can indeed choose to turn and walk away from our salvation even after previously choosing to accept it. |
|
|
|
John 6
Jan 3, 2009 12:53:40 GMT -5
Post by cradlecathlic27 on Jan 3, 2009 12:53:40 GMT -5
I totally agree!...watchman
|
|
|
|
John 6
Jan 5, 2009 10:25:06 GMT -5
Post by Cepha on Jan 5, 2009 10:25:06 GMT -5
How about we move on and discuss John 6:48-59! Or even John 6:66. This verse clearly shows that there were some that had once chose to walk with Christ that turned from Him and decided to no longer walk with Him. We can indeed choose to turn and walk away from our salvation even after previously choosing to accept it. Yep...and did you notice the numbers of that particular verse? John 6: 66  |
|
|
|
John 6
Jan 5, 2009 10:29:53 GMT -5
Post by Cepha on Jan 5, 2009 10:29:53 GMT -5
I totally agree!...watchman Me 3! |
|
reformed
New Member
Sola Deo Gloria
Posts: 6
|
John 6
Feb 12, 2009 18:12:37 GMT -5
Post by reformed on Feb 12, 2009 18:12:37 GMT -5
Of course since Salvation isn't Guaranteed. Judas ate Jesus' flesh and drank His blood. The point I'm making is that the blood and flesh Jesus mentioned in John 6 are not literal. If they were, then whoever ate his flesh and blood would be eternally saved. I never said that John 6 refers to the last supper. |
|
