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Post by Cepha on Feb 15, 2009 15:38:41 GMT -5
I didn't deny it because I could not remember what I did or did not say a year ago. However I did not call catholics children of the devil, I said ''Catholicism'' is corrupt and full of false doctrine, and so is protestantism, I was not favoring protestants over you nor calling catholic people children of the devil. You created the lie, that i think all catholics are children of the devil that is simply not true. Ok, then answer these questions: 1. Now, if you were apologizing for only the things you said, then what does that say about the weight of your apology "now" when you're repeating the same behavior that you did back then? 2. Don't forget...you called our Church "evil" too. If not from Satan, where does evil come from? 3. Then explain to me why I said you did (called us children of Satan) and why you never called me out on it back then if it wasn't true, why you went on to "clean it up" by rephrasing that not all Catholics were children of Satan? 4. If you never said it, there'd be no need for you to clarify yourself back then, would there? |
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Post by Cepha on Feb 15, 2009 15:43:10 GMT -5
You now what I just realized? That if you can't deny that you said it, how can you say that I'm lieing? And, if it's difficult for you to remember whether you said it or not today, 1/2 a year later, why didn't you deny it back then when it was being said over and over by me 1/2 a year ago? I'll wait for your answers to my first few questions.  |
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Post by teresahrc on Feb 15, 2009 15:52:33 GMT -5
hehe...drop kick?  Watchman, this is ridiculous! Cepha may be a bit bold at times, and um (sorry Cepha) is the first to admit he is far from perfect. But to tell him "your father lies and is the father of all lies" is really uncalled for, and um...just reinforcing our delight in being Catholic. (because we know what we believe, who we believe in, and why, and because we don't worry about what other's think) Those that started the religion... well, that would be Jesus, Peter, Andrew, all the Apostles, those that prosper it... that would be the Saints like St. Irenaeus, St. Polycarp, the Martyrs, St. Francis, Mother Teresa etc. Anyway, it is really odd for you (a Christian) to say that a Church that professes Christ as Lord (and believes that God raised Him from the dead) is from the devil? Obviously there are aspects of Catholicism that you disagree with, but surely you don't reject the fact that everything we do and believe is completely centered on the Lord Jesus Christ? |
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Post by Cepha on Feb 15, 2009 16:03:10 GMT -5
Shhh!  Who told you about the drop kicks?  He just literally called me "Satan". But I'm in good company...Jesus too was accused of being in league with Satan by the zealots of His time. I believe Watchman uses "their" Old Testament canon, right? Makes sense. Also makes me think of when Jesus says that we are to rejoice when we are insulted for our faith.  T, he was the first person I ever banned from this site. Now, with as tolerant as I am, imagine how bad he had to be for me to do that? You know that I lovvve to mix it up, but when it started to affect the others here, I cut him off. Notice how the aggression in his posts grows and his insults get more bitter. By this time tomorrow, he'll become completely unravelled because Anti-Catholics just can't control their hate. It eats them up from the inside/out. God knows he's wrong...but, he definitely is good to have around. The more he writes, the more irrational he makes Anti-Catholics seem. (Now...get ready for the great departure speech from him next along with the great proclamation of his superiority to our Church...they are so predictable...or, I could just be trying to manipulate him into sticking around so that I can continue to inquisition him. Who knows? Keep them guessing I always say.)  |
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Post by watchman on Feb 15, 2009 17:25:45 GMT -5
I didn't deny it because I could not remember what I did or did not say a year ago. However I did not call catholics children of the devil, I said ''Catholicism'' is corrupt and full of false doctrine, and so is protestantism, I was not favoring protestants over you nor calling catholic people children of the devil. You created the lie, that i think all catholics are children of the devil that is simply not true. Ok, then answer these questions: 1. Now, if you were apologizing for only the things you said, then what does that say about the weight of your apology "now" when you're repeating the same behavior that you did back then? 2. Don't forget...you called our Church "evil" too. If not from Satan, where does evil come from? 3. Then explain to me why I said you did (called us children of Satan) and why you never called me out on it back then if it wasn't true, why you went on to "clean it up" by rephrasing that not all Catholics were children of Satan? 4. If you never said it, there'd be no need for you to clarify yourself back then, would there? Where did these 4 questions come from, I never apologized for anything. |
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Post by Cepha on Feb 15, 2009 17:31:54 GMT -5
Ok, then answer these questions: 1. Now, if you were apologizing for only the things you said, then what does that say about the weight of your apology "now" when you're repeating the same behavior that you did back then? 2. Don't forget...you called our Church "evil" too. If not from Satan, where does evil come from? 3. Then explain to me why I said you did (called us children of Satan) and why you never called me out on it back then if it wasn't true, why you went on to "clean it up" by rephrasing that not all Catholics were children of Satan? 4. If you never said it, there'd be no need for you to clarify yourself back then, would there? Where did these 4 questions come from, I never apologized for anything. These 4 questions are right in this thread.  And, yes you did apologize for "how" you spoke to us...hold on, BRB... |
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Post by Cepha on Feb 15, 2009 17:34:39 GMT -5
Here you go...page four of the "Hey Chickens" Thread on the Anti-Catholics Board...
Re: Hi chickens...
« Reply #68 on Aug 6, 2008, 7:16am »
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Aug 5, 2008, 11:23pm, watchman wrote:
Now you have made me fell bad, I have made some post since this afternoon that i need to apologize for, and I am not just throwing those words around either. These type of discussion do sometimes bring the worst out of me and I too am truly sorry for what I have said, some you have seen and some you may see later, but you will notice that they were b4 this post.
I would like to discuss these matters without the name calling and I would be happy to continue the 1st Corinthians discussion tomorrow.
May God lead us both into all truths.
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Post by watchman on Feb 15, 2009 17:35:20 GMT -5
That is my opinion of him, I would have kept it to myself until he forced the issue. Those that started the religion... well, that would be Jesus, Peter, Andrew, all the Apostles, those that prosper it... that would be the Saints like St. Irenaeus, St. Polycarp, the Martyrs, St. Francis, Mother Teresa etc. Anyway, it is really odd for you (a Christian) to say that a Church that professes Christ as Lord (and believes that God raised Him from the dead) is from the devil? Obviously there are aspects of Catholicism that you disagree with, but surely you don't reject the fact that everything we do and believe is completely centered on the Lord Jesus Christ? I simply do not believe your assertion that Jesus, Peter, or any disciple created Catholicism. I believe it to be true that Catholicism was not created until after Constantine not only legalized Christianity but commanded that all accept it and started the process of funneling into a solitary set of beliefs. The problem is those beliefs gradually morphed from truth to catholicism between the 3rd and 5th centuries. From the 5th to the 15th century the church was immersed in this false religion. The reformation was a needed thing but did little to get the church back from were the Catholics took us to a semblance of where God would have us to be. The church as a whole catholics and protestants a like are far from the truth taught to us in scripture by the Apostles. |
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Post by Cepha on Feb 15, 2009 17:49:10 GMT -5
I simply do not believe your assertion that Jesus, Peter, or any disciple created Catholicism. Fair enough. What denomination did they belong to since they weren't universal (Catholic) Christians? History disagrees with you. There are records of The Church being called The Catholic Church as early as the beginning of the 2nd Century (hundreds of years before Jesus confronted Constantine). While some try to say that Saint Ignatius meant "the universal body of believers" (which is true) while putting what is known as The Catholic Church out of that body, if one takes the entire passage from which that quote comes that "wherever is Jesus Christ, there is The Catholic Church", he talks about and defends rituals and sacraments that ONLY Catholics practice today so when he said The Catholic Church, he meant The Catholic Church (no other denominations existed back then and The Catholic Church did). 2ndly, Christianity was never "legalized"...it became "protected". Big difference. And he never outlawed any of the other faiths that were being practiced at the time. What he did do was to overtake pagan temples that belonged to the Empire and hand them over to The Christian Church. Some have tried to imply that he made it the "official" Church of The Empire, but when I've requested proof from those who've made these accusations, I never heard back from them. Fact is, Constantine is quoted as saying that his only job for Christianity was to enforce what the Church leadership came to teach. He literally said this. He had nothing to do with her doctrines only with protecting her and supporting her. And hey, that's between him and Jesus. That is a matter of personal opinion, but cannot be proven biblically or otherwise. Fact is, The Church gets to decide for The Church what is right and wrong for The Church (not us). The Reformation was an attempt to "reform" The Catholic Church, but it miserably failed and led to the creation and fragmentation of those who took up positions against The Church (hence, the prophecy of The 2 Houses Jesus spoke of coming true...that the Church built upon Peter would be unshakeable and strone while the church built upon men [Luther, Calvin, Zwingli, etc...] would collapse and fall into pieces...aka "denominations"). [" denominations"? " demonations"? I don't know...ya'll be the judge] [thank the heavens!] Really? Where? Matter of fact, I will start a brand new thread "just for you" to prove this! 
AND, WE'RE BACK! Find your thread here: www.fideidefensor.proboards80.com/index.cgi?board=christiantradition&action=display&thread=495 ;D |
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Post by watchman on Feb 15, 2009 22:09:32 GMT -5
Here you go...page four of the "Hey Chickens" Thread on the Anti-Catholics Board... Re: Hi chickens... « Reply #68 on Aug 6, 2008, 7:16am » -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Aug 5, 2008, 11:23pm, watchman wrote:Now you have made me fell bad, I have made some post since this afternoon that i need to apologize for, and I am not just throwing those words around either. These type of discussion do sometimes bring the worst out of me and I too am truly sorry for what I have said, some you have seen and some you may see later, but you will notice that they were b4 this post.
I would like to discuss these matters without the name calling and I would be happy to continue the 1st Corinthians discussion tomorrow.
May God lead us both into all truths. That was for calling you retarded. |
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Post by Cepha on Feb 15, 2009 22:42:20 GMT -5
Here you go...page four of the "Hey Chickens" Thread on the Anti-Catholics Board... Re: Hi chickens... « Reply #68 on Aug 6, 2008, 7:16am » -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Aug 5, 2008, 11:23pm, watchman wrote:Now you have made me fell bad, I have made some post since this afternoon that i need to apologize for, and I am not just throwing those words around either. These type of discussion do sometimes bring the worst out of me and I too am truly sorry for what I have said, some you have seen and some you may see later, but you will notice that they were b4 this post.
I would like to discuss these matters without the name calling and I would be happy to continue the 1st Corinthians discussion tomorrow.
May God lead us both into all truths. That was for calling you retarded. So I'm not retarded, but I'm Satan? Gee, thanks, I feel so much better now. |
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Post by watchman on Feb 15, 2009 22:46:54 GMT -5
No you are not retarded, you are very intelligent, I called you retarded because you asked a question I had answer 3 or 4 times over.
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Post by teresahrc on Feb 17, 2009 14:16:33 GMT -5
\
Amazing. Now you are borrowing theology from the Mormons! (or are you Mormon?)
Seriously, that is almost EXACTLY what the Mormons say in justification of their interpretation of scripture, and their need for a renewal of the Church. It's uncanny.
Apostasy
This is from LDS.org, the Mormons webpage:
The only problem is that Jesus said this:
18And I tell you that you are Peter,[c] and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades[d] will not overcome it.[e]
But then again, maybe you take that "literally-ish, symbolically-ish" and think that it doesn't apply for today?
"15 if I am delayed, you will know how people ought to conduct themselves in God's household, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and foundation of the truth."(1 Tim. 3)
Pillars don't "gradually morph", in fact, it's kindof cool that the Bible calls the CHURCH the PILLAR OF TRUTH because if you look at ancient ruins of old Greek and Roman buildings, it is usually the pillars that are still standing (not morphed)
teresa
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Post by teresahrc on Feb 17, 2009 14:17:52 GMT -5
Cepha, my daughter Gazala and I love your Avatar!
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Post by watchman on Feb 17, 2009 16:40:40 GMT -5
\ Amazing. Now you are borrowing theology from the Mormons! (or are you Mormon?) Seriously, that is almost EXACTLY what the Mormons say in justification of their interpretation of scripture, and their need for a renewal of the Church. It's uncanny. Apostasy This is from LDS.org, the Mormons webpage: The only problem is that Jesus said this: 18And I tell you that you are Peter,[c] and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades[d] will not overcome it.[e]But then again, maybe you take that "literally-ish, symbolically-ish" and think that it doesn't apply for today? " 15 if I am delayed, you will know how people ought to conduct themselves in God's household, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and foundation of the truth."(1 Tim. 3)Pillars don't "gradually morph", in fact, it's kindof cool that the Bible calls the CHURCH the PILLAR OF TRUTH because if you look at ancient ruins of old Greek and Roman buildings, it is usually the pillars that are still standing (not morphed) teresa #1 I am not mormon. #2 God always has a remnant satan did not nor cannot prevail, however catholicism, is not ''God's true Church'' as you believe. There members of God's Church scattered through out all denomination including catholic churches. |
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Post by teresahrc on Feb 18, 2009 16:41:39 GMT -5
Actually, we believe that too.
But there can only be one Apostolic Succession, one Church that preserves the Faith from Heresy.
Truth cannot contradict itself, and there was and still is an authoritative Church, VISIBLE (that is it has real people, real deacons, pastors, bishops etc. real sacraments, real baptisms.)
If there was some "Great Apostasy" as you and the Mormons claim, then how on earth was this same Church able to Canonize the Bible?
If the Bible is reliable, it has to be because the Church reliably brought it forth (by the Holy Spirit)
A bad tree cannot produce good fruit watchman!
peace
teresa
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Post by watchman on Feb 18, 2009 18:09:06 GMT -5
You should look at the thread in traditional christianity, cepha has asked if there are any differences between what the Apostles taught and what the catholic church of today teaches. So far I have mentioned just one of the discrepancies between the two. The Amillinneal stand of the catholic church goes against the premillennial stand of the Apostles. If you have any thoughts about that I would like to hear it in that thread, and then I will move on to the next teaching that the catholics have corrupted.
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Post by teresahrc on Feb 18, 2009 19:19:58 GMT -5
Yes, I have thoughts about that.
I think that non-Catholics tend to be overly obsessed with the "end times" and I think it is ridiculous to be obsessed with something that no one really knows how it will happen, but we do know Jesus is coming back.
I think the Church Fathers were to concerned about preaching the gospel and tending to their flock so as not to be making graphs and charts about their end times theories and making sure they all were in agreement.
It's just not at the core of our faith.
The core of Christianity is about loving a person(Jesus Christ) and serving His body, the Church and spreading the gospel.
The "end-times" always have and always will(until the end times are over) be a debatable subject even among godly people because it is somewhat shrouded in mystery.
Since the "Millennialism" debate ranks relatively low on the hierarchy of doctrinal importance, I'm not really worried about it.
It is also known that even those Christians that were mentored by St. John (of Revelation) really didn't understand much of it.
Again, how does it change how Christians are supposed to live their lives? Does it change who Jesus was and is? No.
But we shall soon find out whose theory is correct. Maybe both are wrong.
peace
teresa
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Post by Cepha on Feb 18, 2009 20:24:51 GMT -5
Cepha, my daughter Gazala and I love your Avatar! Awww! Thanks! |
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Post by Cepha on Feb 18, 2009 20:26:34 GMT -5
however catholicism, is not ''God's true Church'' as you believe. There members of God's Church scattered through out all denomination including catholic churches. Is that "in" The Bible? Can you prove that scripturally? |
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Who told you about the drop kicks? 
