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Post by Cepha on Apr 9, 2008 10:25:12 GMT -5
John 6.
The deciding factor of faith among Christians.
The Chapter that separates The Sheep and The Goats who refuse to accept Jesus' words as written and as explained over and over and over and clarified by Jesus Himself.
In this one Chapter of Scripture, we see so many, many of The Body of Christ's problems foretold by Saint John.
We see how those who cannot accept Jesus' words because they can't understand how it could be so walk away from Christ.
Coincidentally, this is in:
John 6:66
We go on to see how only Peter steps up and acknowledges that there is only one person to go to. Here, again Peter is the spokesman for The 12 Apostles, representing their beliefs to Jesus without any refutiation from the rest of The Apostles (which makes me wonder why if The 12 Apostles don't refute Peter speaking for them why do they?).
67Then said Jesus unto the twelve, Will ye also go away?
68Then Simon Peter answered him, Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life.
69And we believe and are sure that thou art that Christ, the Son of the living God.
Here, we see that anybody that is "not" among the believers which Peter leads, they are "not" truly believers.
Then of course there is the dispensation of The Eucharist by Jesus Christ Himself.
Glory be to God.
Amen.
[Credit for the idea of this thread belongs to IMApologetics]
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Post by I.M.Apologetics on Apr 10, 2008 23:13:34 GMT -5
haha, just today while serving at Mass and listening to the Gospel I was thinking on making a thread JUST on this! Haha.
Though it would be more like, "are Protestants the ones who walk away from Jesus saying 'this is hard teaching, who can accept it'?"
:-p
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Post by I.M.Apologetics on Apr 10, 2008 23:14:08 GMT -5
wait.. the credit comes to me? lol... telepathy?  lol jk Pax |
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Post by I.M.Apologetics on Apr 11, 2008 12:48:03 GMT -5
Oh, now I remember.. :-p
So, are all Evangelicals dissenters of the Eucharistic Real Presence of Christ, that they say "this is hard teaching, who can accept it?" and leave?
What about some "Catholics" who may also reject the doctrine, not knowing how crucial it is to the Catholic faith?
What about those who doubt and question it... They don't really reject it, they merely cannot understand it....
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Post by Cepha on Apr 12, 2008 3:17:17 GMT -5
Where are all the "bible believers" when it comes to the scripture threads? 
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Post by Cepha on Apr 12, 2008 3:25:05 GMT -5
Oh, now I remember.. :-p So, are all Evangelicals dissenters of the Eucharistic Real Presence of Christ, that they say "this is hard teaching, who can accept it?" and leave? What about some "Catholics" who may also reject the doctrine, not knowing how crucial it is to the Catholic faith? What about those who doubt and question it... They don't really reject it, they merely cannot understand it.... Anybody who rejects it are dessenters. Remember "when" it was that the Christians in The Gospels truly recognized Jesus even when He was walking among them? They couldn't recognize Him "until" be broke the bread (The Holy Eucharist that was consecrated by His Holy touch)! Luke 24 29But they constrained him, saying, Abide with us: for it is toward evening, and the day is far spent. And he went in to tarry with them. 30And it came to pass, as he sat at meat with them, he took bread, and blessed it, and brake, and gave to them.
31And their eyes were opened, and they knew him; and he vanished out of their sight. 32And they said one to another, Did not our heart burn within us, while he talked with us by the way, and while he opened to us the scriptures? Without The Holy Eucharist as consecrated by a Priest, one cannot see the risen Christ as one can "with" it.  |
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Post by Cepha on Apr 12, 2008 3:25:54 GMT -5
wait.. the credit comes to me? lol... telepathy? lol jk Pax  |
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Post by cradlecathlic27 on Apr 12, 2008 9:25:20 GMT -5
You cannot be Catholic if you do not believe in the Eucharist. That is what being Catholic is all about!
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Post by Cepha on Apr 13, 2008 10:29:01 GMT -5
You cannot be Catholic if you do not believe in the Eucharist. That is what being Catholic is all about! You can't even get into heaven if you're a Christian if you don't believe in The Thanksgiving Meal (literally, The Eucharist). |
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Post by cradlecathlic27 on Apr 13, 2008 12:21:06 GMT -5
Um..seriously cepha, you are not at liberty to judge like that. I dont believe they will not reach heavan, God forgives. Not saying that its right not to believe but id like to think Protestants will go to heavan.  |
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Post by Cepha on Apr 13, 2008 12:42:58 GMT -5
Um..seriously cepha, you are not at liberty to judge like that. I dont believe they will not reach heavan, God forgives. Not saying that its right not to believe but id like to think Protestants will go to heavan.:) Well said, but those aren't my words... John 6:53 So Jesus said to them, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink His blood, you have no life in yourselves."This doesn't apply to non-believers, but to those who call themselves Christian believers because this is who Jesus was addressing (His followers). I'm not excluding them. Jesus is. A non-Christian has a better chance to get into heaven than a person who says they believe, but don't. Remember the parable? Matthew 21
28 But what think ye? A man had two sons; and he came to the first, and said, Son, go work to-day in the vineyard.
29 And he answered and said, I will not: but afterward he repented himself, and went.
30 And he came to the second, and said likewise. And he answered and said, I go, sir: and went not.
31 Which of the two did the will of his father? They say, The first. Jesus saith unto them, Verily I say unto you, that the publicans and the harlots go into the kingdom of God before you. Here, Jesus talks about those who claim to believe, here The Word of God and still refuse to truly believe. |
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Post by Cepha on Apr 13, 2008 12:43:43 GMT -5
By the way, that is a beautiful observation that you would want them to be saved even if they don't accept all of Jesus' beliefs. |
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Post by cradlecathlic27 on Apr 13, 2008 12:51:20 GMT -5
Well, i think Jesus is a pretty forgiving fella, plus you have to remember, its not their faught that they have been taught not to believe it, instead of just believing it.
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Post by Cepha on Apr 13, 2008 13:19:36 GMT -5
Well, i think Jesus is a pretty forgiving fella, plus you have to remember, its not their faught that they have been taught not to believe it, instead of just believing it. Yeah, but when one outrightly calls scripture false and his words not true, that leaves no room for interpretation. It's like someone insisting that the color white is black. |
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Post by I.M.Apologetics on Apr 14, 2008 0:27:38 GMT -5
well, Jesus' words are clear. Whether they want to take them literally, like they should, or otherwise, that's between God and them... They'll respond, but God is indeed merciful. If they have all that it takes to truly believe in the doctrine, but they willfully REJECT it, then it's... a shame.... but even then we cannot truly say they'll go to hell... I'd just say they'd be the last ones to get out of purgatory. hah |
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Post by I.M.Apologetics on Apr 14, 2008 0:28:31 GMT -5
speaking of which, im surprised Purgatory hasn't been brought up yet....
We need more Protestants in this forum.
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Post by Cepha on Apr 14, 2008 1:59:39 GMT -5
speaking of which, im surprised Purgatory hasn't been brought up yet.... We need more Protestants in this forum. Well, we have to be gentle. Little by little. We can't dump it all on them at one time. Most of them can't get past Mary yet (which is Catholic Kindergarten)! LMCBO! |
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