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Post by emily445455 on Apr 4, 2008 11:41:07 GMT -5
God orchestrated the preservation of the Bible thru the order of King James.
The CC Bible had the Aprocopha (sp) though, right?
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Post by Cepha on Apr 6, 2008 8:53:36 GMT -5
God orchestrated the preservation of the Bible thru the order of King James. The CC Bible had the Aprocopha (sp) though, right? What is your proof for that statement? Also, how could (if what you say is true) God contradict Jesus when Jesus quoted from and was taught from The Septugaint version of the Old Testament Canon that has existed in Christianity since the beginning of Christianity? For your statement to be true, God would be calling Jesus a false prophet to quote from books that you say are "not" inspired by God. But I await your proof before I continue that "God orchestrated the preservation of the Bible thru the order of King James." As for The CC having the Apocrypha, no...it's not called the Apocrypha by Christianity. It's only referred to that by a small sect of Christianity. Think about it, if it's "not" the inspired Word of God, why did the Protestants first include them in the KJV as the inspired Word of God, then take them out a hundred years later, then put them back in, then take them out again, then put them back in? If they are not the inspired Word of God, then aren't the Protestants guilty of "adding" words to The Inspired Word of God? Why were they taken out and put back in so many times? And if their not the Word of God, why put them "in" The Word of God if their apochryphal? Do you see the contradiction there? Do you actually know the history of the King James Bible and the 15 "changes" that they made to it called "The Rules"? But again, I await your evidence that "God orchestrated the preservation of the Bible thru the order of King James."  |
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Post by righteousone on Apr 6, 2008 19:28:35 GMT -5
Emily, seriously, how do you think the bible was written down on paper? How old are you?
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Post by Cepha on Apr 8, 2008 10:12:29 GMT -5
I care very much about the Bible and the books therein...I just don't care how God got them there :-D If that makes sense. Well, He got them here through Jesus. How could you "not" care about that?  |
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Post by redsoxfan on Apr 8, 2008 11:41:02 GMT -5
God orchestrated the preservation of the Bible thru the order of King James. The CC Bible had the Aprocopha (sp) though, right? Ok Catholics have what you call the apocrypha in our bible. We call it the Dueterocannonicals. We also have an apocrypha which is not in the bible. They were not considered inspired by God as the dueterocannonicals are. The problem comes when people try to decide what belongs in the bible and what doesnt given how many books there are.  Take care~RSF77 |
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Post by I.M.Apologetics on Apr 10, 2008 23:07:43 GMT -5
God uses sinners, so no, I don't care what kind of man ordered the translation of the KJV. I believe the NIV is a Bible. The CC kept the Word of God from the world for a long, long time  Emily, please look at your contradiction (so I dont use the H word)! First you say you don't care... Then you clarify that you dont care to study about the Bible. You then say you don't care that such man ordered thr translation of the KJV. You say God uses sinners. You then say the Catholic Church "kept the Word of God from the world from a long, long time"... Ok, let's see the contradictions 1. You say you won't study about the Bible, but you readily accept the stupid opinion that the Catholic Church "kept the Bible from the world"... If you truly studied from reliable sources and not ignorant or evil anti-Catholic sources, you'd see how you owe the Catholic Church for safe keeping the Holy Scriptures throughout the centuries - at least until modern escavations. Have you not heard of the Vulgate Bible? Or the Monks in monasteries copying and passing down the Bible for further generations? 2. You say you don't care about what kind of man settled the translation of the KJV, yet you seem to be hesistant when someone states the fact that the Catholic Church settled the canon of Scriptures in the 4th century. 3. You say God can use sinful people, yet I'm sure that if someone said something horrible about Jerome and his Latin translation of the Bible, you would hesitate to take his version... (St. Jerome was a good man, though, maybe grumpy, but not a pedophile or anything like that) 4. You say God can use sinful people, yet you do not want to accept that the Catholic Church, though made of sinners, was guided by the Holy Spirit for the settling of the Holy Scriptures' canon. Pax Christi. PS: I'd suggest begin by looking at beginning sources like wikipedia, en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Development_of_the_New_Testament_canon |
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Post by I.M.Apologetics on Apr 10, 2008 23:12:17 GMT -5
God orchestrated the preservation of the Bible thru the order of King James. The CC Bible had the Aprocopha (sp) though, right? What the .... is the CC Bible? You mean a Roman Catholic translation/edition of the Holy Scriptures? And God did not "preserve" the Bible through KJV because it wasn't around until 1611 or so. Before this there was the Douay-Rheims Bible, and other translations as well. And even before, God used St. Jerome for the Vulgate Bible (Latin translation from the original languages, since Latin is the official language of the Church and it was widely used then more than now). And yes, the Catholic Church, since the begining of the Christian Church, has had the Deuterocanonicals. They were at times disputed, such as Jerome not liking them but Augustine in favor of them. Over all, they were *kept* as part of the Scriptures, hence Martin Luther was able to take them off. Pax Christi. |
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Post by Cepha on Apr 11, 2008 8:34:34 GMT -5
Don't blame her...their not allowed to read history in their church. According to their church, The Holy Bible didn't exist until 1,600 years after Jesus left us. So fr 1,600 years, there were no Christians.
Christianity wasn't born until the 16th Century and it was started by Martin Luther...that is, what they believe is Christianity.
Hopefully, she'll study on her own without the influence of men and she'll (on her own with the guidance of The Holy Spirit) find the truth.
I believe that she wants the truth.
She's just not getting it now.
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Post by emily445455 on Apr 11, 2008 14:15:22 GMT -5
Emily, seriously, how do you think the bible was written down on paper? How old are you? Um..what? Cepha- Catholic preists molest little boys too (as do protestants, I know, just trying to make a point) |
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Post by I.M.Apologetics on Apr 11, 2008 15:15:17 GMT -5
Emily,
the Church is not "ran" only by the priests. There are bishops who submit to the authority of the Pope, who in part submits to God in Scriptures and Tradition. This vague description I've given does not do justice to the great theological and philosophical truths of it, as it is much more complex than this.
So the Catholic Church is not judged by the actions of a minority of priests or its members (especially those who do not know the Church's actual teachings), but to what She actually teaches...
The standard with which to measure the Catholic Church is not against what the people do: we measure what the Catholic people do against what the Church teaches.
Unlike in Protestantism, which barely has anything to measure against, as they all point to the Scriptures but they contradict themselves: some believe in infant baptism others don't, some say abortion and contraception is ok, others don't, etc.
There is no unified teaching in Protestantism.
Even in those "Confessional" denominations there is disagreement, such as with Lutherans.
Pax Christi.
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Post by Cepha on Apr 12, 2008 16:52:18 GMT -5
Emily, seriously, how do you think the bible was written down on paper? How old are you? Um..what? Cepha- Catholic preists molest little boys too (as do protestants, I know, just trying to make a point) Well, ok. But you do know that the statistics by a well respected Protestant source says that Priests sexual occurances (including all of them, not just little boys, but girls too) was about 260 incidents per year. Know how much it is for Protestant Pastors? Protestant Pastors have 3,500 occurances per year. For Priests, it's one occurance every 36 hours. For Pastors, it's one occurance every 20 minutes. Of course, I could be lieing right? reformation.com/www.csmonitor.com/2002/0405/p01s01-ussc.htmlNot making any excuses for the Priests, but the Protestants are the last to talk on molesting children. Besides, the difference between the Protestants and the Catholics is that is is literally church doctrine for some Protestants to molest and have children with children. We're not talking about the private faults of men here, but about the doctrines of a church, a religious practice. So it was fair for me to point it out. Understand? I wasn't attacking the Protestant, but I was attacking the particular Protestant practice that is a practice because of their religion (not becaue they were professing to be Christians). |
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Post by emily445455 on Apr 12, 2008 16:55:12 GMT -5
I was just making a point. Catholics trust priests and they do what King James did. I wasn't saying anything about protestant vs catholic stats...just making a point that people we trust can and do mess up.
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Post by redsoxfan on Apr 12, 2008 21:19:56 GMT -5
Sooooooo.... hmmmm... if I asked you what cannon was in use before Martin Luther jump started the reformation what would you expect it to say?
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Post by Cepha on Apr 13, 2008 13:28:48 GMT -5
I was just making a point. Catholics trust priests and they do what King James did. I wasn't saying anything about protestant vs catholic stats...just making a point that people we trust can and do mess up. But that's what wrong with your religion. It is based on protesting religious guidance by men, but then defends religious guidance by men. Catholics never protested being religiously guided by men. That's what makes Protestantism hypocritical and thus "not" of Christ. It was started by men, of men and for men. Where Catholicism was started by Christ, of Christ and for Christians. |
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Post by emily445455 on Apr 13, 2008 16:01:18 GMT -5
I just protest false religions.
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Post by Cepha on Apr 13, 2008 19:37:32 GMT -5
Wow...a so-called Christian "not" caring how God created The Bible. Unless it's the KJV, right? Because you certainly care about that version and how it got there, right? |
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Post by emily445455 on Apr 13, 2008 20:12:23 GMT -5
Lol, thanks for calling me a "so-called Christian"...real nice.
I fully believe God used men and orcestrated events through-out history to preserve His Word for us.
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Post by Cepha on Apr 13, 2008 20:20:52 GMT -5
Lol, thanks for calling me a "so-called Christian"...real nice. I fully believe God used men and orcestrated events through-out history to preserve His Word for us. Better that saying that I don't consider you a Christian at all, don't you think? (Which is a whole lot less nicer than what I said) Besides, not caring how the Bible was written leads one to being misled into believing things that never existed before the 16th century...such as bible versions that never existed before the 16th century. But hey, if you want to believe in a bible with a man's name on it, go right ahead. The Bible that God created through Christianity had no man's name on it. No man has the right to authorize God's Word. |
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Post by redsoxfan on Apr 15, 2008 11:33:04 GMT -5
Lol, thanks for calling me a "so-called Christian"...real nice. I fully believe God used men and orcestrated events through-out history to preserve His Word for us. Good! So who preserved it til Martin Luther, God Bless him, came around? |
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Post by Cepha on Apr 15, 2008 15:37:06 GMT -5
Lol, thanks for calling me a "so-called Christian"...real nice. I fully believe God used men and orcestrated events through-out history to preserve His Word for us. Good! So who preserved it til Martin Luther, God Bless him, came around? Marty Mar! You know something Baseball Heretic? I used to really dislike him. Then I studied up on him. Check this Thread I started on him that no Protestant seems to want to touch: fideidefensor.proboards80.com/v45index.cgi?action=display&board=denominations&thread=44&page=1They want forget he ever existed. But they lovvvvve his teachings! ;D |
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