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Post by Cepha on May 18, 2009 16:39:00 GMT -5
His name is Michael... not Robert and he is a philosopher, journalist, novelist, and diplomat. An American author of more than twenty-five books on the philosophy and theology of culture, Novak is most widely known for his book The Spirit of Democratic Capitalism (1982). In 2003, Novak publicly argued not only that the Iraq war was licit under Catholic just war teaching, but that it was "morally obligatory" under that teaching. Ohhh...see, that's why I had to ask. I wasn't sure. Thanks Alfie. (Wow...you really are on point today! Kudos! ;D ) Oh, and what about Michael Novak anyway? LOL! |
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Post by emily445455 on May 18, 2009 17:28:42 GMT -5
Yes, he does Emily. The pope's being a real stinker. Sad. Not surprising, but still sad. |
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Post by Cepha on May 18, 2009 17:31:04 GMT -5
Yes, he does Emily. The pope's being a real stinker. Sad. Not surprising, but still sad. No he's not! He's "just" and fair! Palestine is for The Palestinians! God banished The Jews from Israel as their punishment for rejecting Jesus Christ! |
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Post by emily445455 on May 18, 2009 17:32:25 GMT -5
Where is that written?
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Post by Cepha on May 18, 2009 17:34:12 GMT -5
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Post by emily445455 on May 18, 2009 17:59:03 GMT -5
Where in the NT?
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Post by watchman on May 19, 2009 0:01:27 GMT -5
Sad. Not surprising, but still sad. No he's not! He's "just" and fair! Palestine is for The Palestinians! God banished The Jews from Israel as their punishment for rejecting Jesus Christ! And I thought I had heard it all?  ?  |
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Post by emily445455 on May 19, 2009 9:00:43 GMT -5
I believe the Jews are being punished for rejecting Christ. But being banished from the land God promised them isn't part of it.
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Post by teresahrc on May 19, 2009 12:18:49 GMT -5
I will make them one nation in the land, on the mountains of Israel. There will be one king over all of them and they will never again be two nations or be divided into two kingdoms. 23 They will no longer defile themselves with their idols and vile images or with any of their offenses, for I will save them from all their sinful backsliding, and I will cleanse them. They will be my people, and I will be their God.
24 " 'My servant David will be king over them, and they will all have one shepherd. They will follow my laws and be careful to keep my decrees. 25 They will live in the land I gave to my servant Jacob, the land where your ancestors lived. They and their children and their children's children will live there forever, and David my servant will be their prince forever. 26 I will make a covenant of peace with them; it will be an everlasting covenant. I will establish them and increase their numbers, and I will put my sanctuary among them forever. 27 My dwelling place will be with them; I will be their God, and they will be my people. 28 Then the nations will know that I the LORD make Israel holy, when my sanctuary is among them forever.' "
(Ezekiel 37)
Sounds to me like the land is theirs forever Cepha. Remember, the Gentile Christians are "grafted in", so we are included in this promise. But in the book of Romans, it says that somehow "all Israel will be saved". I don't really understand all of that, but I know that God doesn't break His promises, including His promises to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.
peace
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Post by teresahrc on May 19, 2009 12:28:34 GMT -5
Why? You don't believe Christians should be allowed to live in the Holy Land?
You do realize that most of the Christians that live in Israel are Palestinians, many of them trace their heritage back to the first Christians who lived there.
You think your Christian brothers and sisters should not get to be free in the land where Christ lived? Please explain your reasons for this.
You need to read the book Blood Brothers by Elias Chacour, so that you can understand what it is like to be a Palestinian Christian, then maybe you will understand why the Pope is trying to protect the flock there.
peace
teresa
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Post by alfie on May 19, 2009 16:41:30 GMT -5
Why? You don't believe Christians should be allowed to live in the Holy Land? You do realize that most of the Christians that live in Israel are Palestinians, many of them trace their heritage back to the first Christians who lived there. You think your Christian brothers and sisters should not get to be free in the land where Christ lived? Please explain your reasons for this. You need to read the book Blood Brothers by Elias Chacour, so that you can understand what it is like to be a Palestinian Christian, then maybe you will understand why the Pope is trying to protect the flock there. peace teresa According to Wikipedia Christians make up between 40,000 and 90,000 people, or 1.1 to 2.4% of the population of the Palestinian territories. Most are in the West Bank, though there is a community of 2,000 in the Gaza Strip. The related Arab Christians in Israel number between 144,000 and 196,000, or 2.1 to 2.8% of the total population, and about 8.8% of the non-Jewish Arab population. And don't forget George Bush already forced Israel to give back the Gaza Strip to the Moslems. So are you saying Israel should give land to the Christians who are living in Israel and not in the the Arab territories? |
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Post by alfie on May 19, 2009 16:49:28 GMT -5
You are an anti-Semite and yet you have the nerve to accuse me of being a racist (although to a certain extent I will admit that I am). Have the guts to admit it. |
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Post by emily445455 on May 19, 2009 17:18:50 GMT -5
I didn't visit the site...I just wanted a verse....
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Post by teresahrc on May 20, 2009 9:19:51 GMT -5
Why is the population of Christians so small? Most of them have fled. Bethlehem is a small city, but I have personally met many Christians from Bethlehem who have left. Even so, there are still 27,000 Christians in Bethlehem (pop. is 50, 000) and they are basically imprisoned there because of the massive wall built by Israel's Government. Listen, we are called to be peacemakers, period. We know that there will never really be "peace on earth" until Jesus returns, but that does not excuse us from working and praying for peace. 9 Let us not become weary in doing good, for at the proper time we will reap a harvest if we do not give up. 10 Therefore, as we have opportunity, let us do good to all people, especially to those who belong to the family of believers(Galatians 6) I don't care if there are only 2 Christians in Palestine, we are supposed to help them. We are also supposed to help anyone that is being oppressed. I'm glad that the Pope is speaking out. Why aren't more Christians helping their brothers and sisters in the Holy Land? crs-blog.org/bethlehem-jerusalem/peace teresa |
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Post by alfie on May 20, 2009 22:51:25 GMT -5
Why is the population of Christians so small? Most of them have fled. Bethlehem is a small city, but I have personally met many Christians from Bethlehem who have left. Even so, there are still 27,000 Christians in Bethlehem (pop. is 50, 000) and they are basically imprisoned there because of the massive wall built by Israel's Government. Listen, we are called to be peacemakers, period. We know that there will never really be "peace on earth" until Jesus returns, but that does not excuse us from working and praying for peace. 9 Let us not become weary in doing good, for at the proper time we will reap a harvest if we do not give up. 10 Therefore, as we have opportunity, let us do good to all people, especially to those who belong to the family of believers(Galatians 6) I don't care if there are only 2 Christians in Palestine, we are supposed to help them. We are also supposed to help anyone that is being oppressed. I'm glad that the Pope is speaking out. Why aren't more Christians helping their brothers and sisters in the Holy Land? crs-blog.org/bethlehem-jerusalem/peace teresa Iran and Israel are on the brink of a nuclear war and you are concerned about a Palestinian state? In the past Israel has given up land to the Arabs and it hasn't brought peace. |
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Post by teresahrc on May 20, 2009 23:04:47 GMT -5
All the more reason to help the Christians there.
I realize that many people are simply anti-Semetic, or anti-Jewish, period. But many others are only anti-Zionist.
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Post by Cepha on May 21, 2009 10:13:01 GMT -5
Uh, The Gospels? Book of Acts? Who do you think killed Saint Stephen? Who was Paul serving when he killed Christians? Jews. |
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Post by teresahrc on May 21, 2009 10:39:42 GMT -5
 Who were the 12 Apostles, most of the followers of Jesus, Mary mother of God, and Jesus Himself? Jews. So what are you trying to prove Cepha?
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Post by Cepha on May 21, 2009 10:56:54 GMT -5
Who were the 12 Apostles, most of the followers of Jesus, Mary mother of God, and Jesus Himself? Jews. So what are you trying to prove Cepha? I'm not trying to prove anything...Jews (by religion) persecuted Christians (whether Jewish by race or Gentile). It's a fact. They got in bed with The Romans (making them the Whore of Babylon...everybody knows that in Rev, Babylon meant Rome and even Peter used that term while talking of Rome) and they set out to decimate and eliminate The Christian population. They rejected Jesus Christ. They killed Jesus Christ's followers for loving and proclaiming The Gospel. And God does not reward evil with good. God rewards evil done (especially in His Holy name I would think) with "just" punishment. Anyway, according to everybody here but me, Jews are damned to hell for rejecting Jesus Christ, right? Unless, there's a "special" exception made just for them? |
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Post by Cepha on May 21, 2009 10:58:05 GMT -5
Who were the 12 Apostles, most of the followers of Jesus, Mary mother of God, and Jesus Himself? Jews. So what are you trying to prove Cepha? Oh, by the way, by the year 70 AD, most Christians were no longer Jews, but Gentiles. Coincidentally what happened in 70 AD? The Temple was destroyed scattering The Jews once again. Coincidence? Or God's wrath on them for rejecting Christ? |
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