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Post by Ramon on Jun 12, 2009 10:52:14 GMT -5
This is hysterical. According to Wikipedia the Orthodox Church traditionally teaches that while images of God, the Father, remain prohibited, depictions of Jesus as the incarnation of God as a visible human are permissible. To emphasize the theological importance of the incarnation, the Orthodox Church encourages the use of icons in church and private devotions, but generally prefers a non-naturalistic, two-dimensional depiction as a reminder of this theological aspect. In modern use (usually as a result of Roman Catholic influence), more naturalistic images and images of the Father, however, also appear occasionally in Orthodox churches, but statues, i.e. three-dimensional depictions, continue to be banned No, what's hysterical is you researching my Apostolic Church via Wikipedia instead of sitting down with a Orthodox Priest! Very Funny! But my dear lady, statues are not forbidden in the Orthodox Church. However, we prefer Holy Icons, which is why you rarely see Statues in Orthodox Churches. But some churches (i.e., Western Rite Orthodox Churches) and some Eastern Monasteries, there exist Statues. You know you should do? Stop getting your information from Wikipedia, where any madman can post information, and start going to Canonical Orthodox Church, and get your information there. Maybe if you did, you will convert and come home to the Church started by Christ and preserved by the Holy Apostles, the Church of East, the One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church, in short, the Holy Eastern Orthodox Catholic Church. For Jews and Muslims veneration violates this commandment. Jews and Muslims read this commandment as prohibiting the use of idols and images in any way. Didn't mind the Jews in the Old Testament......... Tradionally, the Orthodox have criticized the Roman Catholic use of decorative statues while Roman Catholics have criticized the Orthodox veneration of icons. This sentence is hysterical. ;D Hysterical, yes, as I find no evidence in the Orthodox Church for such statements! LOL. While some Orthodox Christians, in past times and present, have criticized the Roman Catholic use of statues, no such infallible decree of rejection, exist in the Orthodox Church on Statues. There is no Orthodox Canon Law that states statues are forbidden in Orthodox parishes, monasteries, etc. Up until the Council of Chalcedon the Western Church condemned the use of statutes or icons in church but the Western Church finally gave in to the Eastern Church and allowed them to use icons in their churches because they were already using them. Eventually that led to Catholics using statues in their churches. So up until the Council of Chalcedon icons and statues were considered idolatry. So you are talking about a period of hundreds of years before the council met where the use of icons and statues was considered a sin. Give a Historical source that back you up on this. While Holy Icons [as seen today] and Statues were rarely seen for hundreds of years, and was consider "wrong" by many, there still existed in Church History. It was not only until the Icon battle, that the Church had to pronounce a infallible decree concerning Holy Icons. You see how this has led to a slippery slope? Catholics are obsessed with the Virgin Mary which has caused Marian appriations to happen throughout the world. No, I do not see. I only seen the Truth, not lies. The Orthodox Church has never been obsessed with the Holy Virgin Mary. We just follow Scriptures and Tradition and honor her above all Saints and Angels and seek her powerful intercession. In IC.XC, Ramon |
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Post by Cepha on Jun 12, 2009 10:54:36 GMT -5
Hey Ramon,
You know she's in real danger now, right?
She's actually reading The Church Fathers to try to prove us wrong!
Know what that means?
She's going to be bumping into a lot of "truth" now!
LOL!
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Post by alfie on Jun 12, 2009 12:52:38 GMT -5
Hey Ramon, You know she's in real danger now, right? She's actually reading The Church Fathers to try to prove us wrong! Know what that means? She's going to be bumping into a lot of "truth" now! LOL! Acts 20:29 Paul says "For I know this, that after my departure savage wolves will come in among you, not sparing the flock. Acts 20:30 Also among yourselves men will rise up, speaking prverse things, to draw away disciples after themselves. How do you know that the wolves aren't the ECFS? Why wouldn't it be the ECFS? Some of them were alive when Paul spoke those words. After all you claim the Protestant church didn't start until Martin Luther so it can't be them. And why not the ECFS? Adam and Eve were deceived soon after they were created. It bugs me when you guys claim truth is defined by time span. |
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Post by Ramon on Jun 12, 2009 12:53:15 GMT -5
Hey Ramon, You know she's in real danger now, right? She's actually reading The Church Fathers to try to prove us wrong! Know what that means? She's going to be bumping into a lot of "truth" now! LOL! LOL! Once she read the The Church Fathers, she will realize that Protestants, Methodists in specfic, have lost the true Faith once delievered to the Saints. Don't worry Cepha. She will come around. I did! ;D The Church Fathers was the "button" for me. I couldn't sit in a Pentecostal Church any longer after knowing what the Church of the first 1,000 years taught and practice. In IC.XC, Ramon |
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Post by Ramon on Jun 12, 2009 12:55:54 GMT -5
How do you know that the wolves aren't the ECFS? Why wouldn't it be the ECFS? Some of them were alive when Paul spoke those words. After all you claim the Protestant church didn't start until Martin Luther so it can't be them. And why not the ECFS? Adam and Eve were deceived soon after they were created. It bugs me when you guys claim truth is defined by time span. Because Christ' promise that the gates of Hades will not prevail against the Church (Matthew 16:18). For you, somehow, the Holy Spirit was present in the Apostolic Era, but then he left and came back 1,500 years later to enlighten some group of men. According to you, he did not guide his Church to all truth, because somehow, the Church as a whole, after the Holy Apostles death, got corrupted. "And the things that thou hast heard of me among many witnesses, the same commit thou to faithful men, who shall be able to teach others also." (2 Tim 2:2). I believe the Church did not get corrupt and still exist today, teaching the fullness of the faith, because I trust in the Holy Spirit. And you accept 27 books in the NT only because the Early Church Fathers said so. For four centuries, there was heavy debate on what should be included in the Holy Scriptures. Several Early Councils decided that there should be only 27 books in the NT (ie.., the Council of Rome, etc) whose list became the norm for future Christians. So if the Early Church Fathers was good enough to decide on what should be included in the Holy Bible, why are they not good enough to pass along the Apostolic Faith uncorrupt to future generation? Why did God guided them in this regard, but never guided them on the right interpretation of Scriptures? It bugs how many you belittle God! In IC.XC, Ramon P.S, also many heresies arose in the 1,000 years of Church History, yet the Church fought against them. |
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Post by alfie on Jun 12, 2009 13:04:45 GMT -5
How do you know that the wolves aren't the ECFS? Why wouldn't it be the ECFS? Some of them were alive when Paul spoke those words. After all you claim the Protestant church didn't start until Martin Luther so it can't be them. And why not the ECFS? Adam and Eve were deceived soon after they were created. It bugs me when you guys claim truth is defined by time span. Because Christ' promise that the gates of Hades will not prevail against the Church (Matthew 16:18). For you, somehow, the Holy Spirit was present in the Apostolic Era, but then he left and came back 1,500 years later to enlighten some group of men. According to you, he did not guide his Church to all truth, because somehow, the Church as a whole, after the Holy Apostles death, got corrupted. "And the things that thou hast heard of me among many witnesses, the same commit thou to faithful men, who shall be able to teach others also." (2 Tim 2:2). I believe the Church did not get corrupt and still exist today, teaching the fullness of the faith, because I trust in the Holy Spirit. And You accept 27 books in the NT only because the Early Church Fathers said so. For four centuries, there was heavy debate on what was should be included in the Holy Scriptures. Several early councils decided that there should be only 27 books in the NT (ie.., the Council of Rome, etc) whose list became the norm for future Christians. In IC.XC, Ramon P.S, also many heries arose in the 1,000 years of Church Year, yet the Church fought agaist them. The ECFS wrote in a number of languages. There is Syriac, Latin, a Greek, Hebrew, and a number of other obscure languages that some of them are written in. You mean all of these guys with so many different languages (especially the obscure ones) were hanging out with the Apostles? |
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Post by Ramon on Jun 12, 2009 13:05:53 GMT -5
Because Christ' promise that the gates of Hades will not prevail against the Church (Matthew 16:18). For you, somehow, the Holy Spirit was present in the Apostolic Era, but then he left and came back 1,500 years later to enlighten some group of men. According to you, he did not guide his Church to all truth, because somehow, the Church as a whole, after the Holy Apostles death, got corrupted. "And the things that thou hast heard of me among many witnesses, the same commit thou to faithful men, who shall be able to teach others also." (2 Tim 2:2). I believe the Church did not get corrupt and still exist today, teaching the fullness of the faith, because I trust in the Holy Spirit. And You accept 27 books in the NT only because the Early Church Fathers said so. For four centuries, there was heavy debate on what was should be included in the Holy Scriptures. Several early councils decided that there should be only 27 books in the NT (ie.., the Council of Rome, etc) whose list became the norm for future Christians. In IC.XC, Ramon P.S, also many heries arose in the 1,000 years of Church Year, yet the Church fought agaist them. The ECFS wrote in a number of languages. There is Syriac, Latin, a Greek, Hebrew, and a number of other obscure languages that some of them are written in. You mean all of these guys with so many different languages (especially the obscure ones) were hanging out with the Apostles? So you saying languages creates barriers to the Truth? "When the day of Pentecost came, they were all together in one place. Suddenly a sound like the blowing of a violent wind came from heaven and filled the whole house where they were sitting. They saw what seemed to be tongues of fire that separated and came to rest on each of them. All of them were filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in other tongues as the Spirit enabled them.
Now there were staying in Jerusalem God-fearing Jews from every nation under heaven. When they heard this sound, a crowd came together in bewilderment, because each one heard them speaking in his own language
Utterly amazed, they asked: "Are not all these men who are speaking Galileans? Then how is it that each of us hears them in his own native language? Parthians, Medes and Elamites; residents of Mesopotamia, Judea and Cappadocia, Pontus and Asia, 10Phrygia and Pamphylia, Egypt and the parts of Libya near Cyrene; visitors from Rome (both Jews and converts to Judaism Cretans and Arabs—we hear them declaring the wonders of God in our own tongues!" Amazed and perplexed, they asked one another, "What does this mean?" " (Acts 2:1-12)
In IC.XC,
Ramon |
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Post by alfie on Jun 12, 2009 13:11:08 GMT -5
Hey Ramon, You know she's in real danger now, right? She's actually reading The Church Fathers to try to prove us wrong! Know what that means? She's going to be bumping into a lot of "truth" now! LOL! LOL! Once she read the The Church Fathers, she will realize that Protestants, Methodists in specfic, have lost the true Faith once delievered to the Saints. Don't worry Cepha. She will come around. I did! ;D The Church Fathers was the "button" for me. I couldn't sit in a Pentecostal Church any longer after knowing what the Church of the first 1,000 years taught and practice. In IC.XC, Ramon I'm sick to death of hearing about how the CC has been around for the first 1000 years. It was at least a thousand years after Adam and Eve screwed up before Jesus came? Why didn't He come 1000 years BC so all of those people could be in the Catholic Church? |
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Post by Ramon on Jun 12, 2009 13:15:04 GMT -5
LOL! Once she read the The Church Fathers, she will realize that Protestants, Methodists in specfic, have lost the true Faith once delievered to the Saints. Don't worry Cepha. She will come around. I did! ;D The Church Fathers was the "button" for me. I couldn't sit in a Pentecostal Church any longer after knowing what the Church of the first 1,000 years taught and practice. In IC.XC, Ramon I'm sick to death of hearing about how the CC has been around for the first 1000 years. It was at least a thousand years after Adam and Eve screwed up before Jesus came? Why didn't He come 1000 years BC so all of those people could be in the Catholic Church? Answer the question I asked you before please. Second, for 1,000 years, there has only been ONE Church. It was called by various names, such as The Way, The Catholic Church, the One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church. I am not talking about the "Roman Catholic Church", a name given to the Western Apostolic Church after the Great Schism of 1054AD. Perhaps, it will be wise for you to research what the word "Catholic" originally meant. I am sick of death of people like you that say that somehow the Holy Spirit was present in the Apostolic Era, but then he left and came back 1,500 years later to enlighten some group of men. I am sick and tired of people like you that believe Christ did not guide his Church to all truth, because somehow, the Church as a whole, after the Holy Apostles death, got corrupted. I am sick to death of hearing that somehow the gates of Hades did prevail (cf. Matthew 16:18). In IC.XC, Ramon |
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Post by alfie on Jun 12, 2009 13:42:15 GMT -5
I'm sick to death of hearing about how the CC has been around for the first 1000 years. It was at least a thousand years after Adam and Eve screwed up before Jesus came? Why didn't He come 1000 years BC so all of those people could be in the Catholic Church? Answer the question I asked you before please. Second, for 1,000 years, there has only been ONE Church. It was called by various names, such as The Way, The Catholic Church, the One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church. I am not talking about the "Roman Catholic Church", a name given to the Western Apostolic Church after the Great Schism of 1054AD. Perhaps, it will be wise for you to research what the word "Catholic" originally meant. I am sick of death of people like you that say that somehow the Holy Spirit was present in the Apostolic Era, but then he left and came back 1,500 years later to enlighten some group of men. I am sick and tired of people like you that believe Christ did not guide his Church to all truth, because somehow, the Church as a whole, after the Holy Apostles death, got corrupted. I am sick to death of hearing that somehow the gates of Hades did prevail (cf. Matthew 16:18). In IC.XC, Ramon Why not? In the Old Testament few people were indwelt with the Holy Spirit. Same thing with Luther. Few people were indwelt with the Holy Spirit until Luthers time. God talks about having a remnant of true believers throughout both the Old and New Testament. Few people now or in the past have been true believers. The people who aren't true believers only have a form of godliness but deny the power. They are too busy with "bells and smells" to see the real meaning of the gospel. And just why was there a schism? And why aren't you Roman Catholic? The schism was due to different opinions on dogma like the filoque and Rome not sending armies to Constantinople to help fight the Turks. But mostly it was because the Roman Church was so corrupt that Constantine tried to switch the church to Constantinople. The RCC had been gradually becoming more and more corrupt until corruption culminated and the Reformation was needed put a stop to it. |
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Post by Cepha on Jun 12, 2009 15:10:29 GMT -5
Hey Ramon, You know she's in real danger now, right? She's actually reading The Church Fathers to try to prove us wrong! Know what that means? She's going to be bumping into a lot of "truth" now! LOL! Acts 20:29 Paul says "For I know this, that after my departure savage wolves will come in among you, not sparing the flock. Acts 20:30 Also among yourselves men will rise up, speaking prverse things, to draw away disciples after themselves. How do you know that the wolves aren't the ECFS? Why wouldn't it be the ECFS? Some of them were alive when Paul spoke those words. After all you claim the Protestant church didn't start until Martin Luther so it can't be them. And why not the ECFS? Adam and Eve were deceived soon after they were created. It bugs me when you guys claim truth is defined by time span. Easy...because The Church is what guides us (not The Church Fathers). Not everything that they wrote is truthful. Remember, Christian Doctrines hadn't been figured out yet until the councils were held). It was The Church (not the individual Church Fathers) that decided doctrine. The Holy Spirit guides The Church so it teaches the truth. Whoever said that truth was defined by time span? History is defined by time span.  |
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Post by Cepha on Jun 12, 2009 15:14:03 GMT -5
Hey Ramon, You know she's in real danger now, right? She's actually reading The Church Fathers to try to prove us wrong! Know what that means? She's going to be bumping into a lot of "truth" now! LOL! LOL! Once she read the The Church Fathers, she will realize that Protestants, Methodists in specfic, have lost the true Faith once delievered to the Saints. Don't worry Cepha. She will come around. I did! ;D The Church Fathers was the "button" for me. I couldn't sit in a Pentecostal Church any longer after knowing what the Church of the first 1,000 years taught and practice. In IC.XC, Ramon Well, it's not up to her really. It's up to The Holy Spirit. First, she will have to cleanse her heart of all that Anti-Christianity she's harboring, then The Holy Spirit will reveal The Truth to her. But she has to take the first step. The Holy Spirit doesn't dwell where there is malice. It finds such things contemptuous. When I was an arrogant Anti-Catholic spewing rhetoric that was indoctrinated into me, I didn't have The Holy Spirit. But when I broke away from those man-created post 16th Century doctrines, my eyes were opened and I found Jesus everywhere, in every face, in every church, in every religion where it spoke truth. But, Jesus told me to go to His Church (which I did). |
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Post by Cepha on Jun 12, 2009 15:19:20 GMT -5
Because Christ' promise that the gates of Hades will not prevail against the Church (Matthew 16:18). For you, somehow, the Holy Spirit was present in the Apostolic Era, but then he left and came back 1,500 years later to enlighten some group of men. According to you, he did not guide his Church to all truth, because somehow, the Church as a whole, after the Holy Apostles death, got corrupted. "And the things that thou hast heard of me among many witnesses, the same commit thou to faithful men, who shall be able to teach others also." (2 Tim 2:2). I believe the Church did not get corrupt and still exist today, teaching the fullness of the faith, because I trust in the Holy Spirit. And You accept 27 books in the NT only because the Early Church Fathers said so. For four centuries, there was heavy debate on what was should be included in the Holy Scriptures. Several early councils decided that there should be only 27 books in the NT (ie.., the Council of Rome, etc) whose list became the norm for future Christians. In IC.XC, Ramon P.S, also many heries arose in the 1,000 years of Church Year, yet the Church fought agaist them. The ECFS wrote in a number of languages. There is Syriac, Latin, a Greek, Hebrew, and a number of other obscure languages that some of them are written in. You mean all of these guys with so many different languages (especially the obscure ones) were hanging out with the Apostles? What do you think the gift of "tounges" is? It's the ability for The Apostles to communicate to others in their own language. They spread The Gospel to the civilized world then The Catholic Church brought it to The New World after that when we discovered America. The Church had no limitations geographically "after" the 4th Century because this is when Constantine The Great protected The Church so that she could evangelize from the center of the civilized world which was in Rome. Rome back then is like what New York is today...the capitol of The World. All roads led to Rome. What better place from which to launch the greatest marketing campaign in history? If you reflect upon history with reason and with an open mind ready to accept whatever can be unbiasedly proven, then a lot of what you've been taught will begin to seep out of you and you'll come face to face with truth. |
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Post by Cepha on Jun 12, 2009 15:21:31 GMT -5
The ECFS wrote in a number of languages. There is Syriac, Latin, a Greek, Hebrew, and a number of other obscure languages that some of them are written in. You mean all of these guys with so many different languages (especially the obscure ones) were hanging out with the Apostles? So you saying languages creates barriers to the Truth? "When the day of Pentecost came, they were all together in one place. Suddenly a sound like the blowing of a violent wind came from heaven and filled the whole house where they were sitting. They saw what seemed to be tongues of fire that separated and came to rest on each of them. All of them were filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in other tongues as the Spirit enabled them.
Now there were staying in Jerusalem God-fearing Jews from every nation under heaven. When they heard this sound, a crowd came together in bewilderment, because each one heard them speaking in his own language
Utterly amazed, they asked: "Are not all these men who are speaking Galileans? Then how is it that each of us hears them in his own native language? Parthians, Medes and Elamites; residents of Mesopotamia, Judea and Cappadocia, Pontus and Asia, 10Phrygia and Pamphylia, Egypt and the parts of Libya near Cyrene; visitors from Rome (both Jews and converts to Judaism Cretans and Arabs—we hear them declaring the wonders of God in our own tongues!" Amazed and perplexed, they asked one another, "What does this mean?" " (Acts 2:1-12)
In IC.XC,
RamonLOL! You're getting like me and Teresa now! Answering with the same answers in different words! But hey! It's easy when you're speaking the truth, isn't it! |
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Post by Cepha on Jun 12, 2009 15:25:46 GMT -5
LOL! Once she read the The Church Fathers, she will realize that Protestants, Methodists in specfic, have lost the true Faith once delievered to the Saints. Don't worry Cepha. She will come around. I did! ;D The Church Fathers was the "button" for me. I couldn't sit in a Pentecostal Church any longer after knowing what the Church of the first 1,000 years taught and practice. In IC.XC, Ramon I'm sick to death of hearing about how the CC has been around for the first 1000 years. Actually it's more like 2,000 years. Why do historical facts make you sick? He came when it was His time to come. And, all He could do was just start The Church. He couldn't force everybody to join it. He commissioned the Apostles (who taught the first Church Fathers) to spread The Gospel. The Apostolic Fathers developed Doctrine. The Church Fathers (post 4th Century with Christianity's new best friend and former persecutor) with Rome's protection organized The Church. And so on and so on. God's Church wasn't meant to be like a light one hides under a cover, but it's meant to be exposed so that all could see it for it's beauty and know it's truth! |
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Post by Cepha on Jun 12, 2009 15:27:06 GMT -5
I'm sick to death of hearing about how the CC has been around for the first 1000 years. It was at least a thousand years after Adam and Eve screwed up before Jesus came? Why didn't He come 1000 years BC so all of those people could be in the Catholic Church? Answer the question I asked you before please. Second, for 1,000 years, there has only been ONE Church. It was called by various names, such as The Way, The Catholic Church, the One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church. I am not talking about the "Roman Catholic Church", a name given to the Western Apostolic Church after the Great Schism of 1054AD. Perhaps, it will be wise for you to research what the word "Catholic" originally meant. I am sick of death of people like you that say that somehow the Holy Spirit was present in the Apostolic Era, but then he left and came back 1,500 years later to enlighten some group of men. I am sick and tired of people like you that believe Christ did not guide his Church to all truth, because somehow, the Church as a whole, after the Holy Apostles death, got corrupted. I am sick to death of hearing that somehow the gates of Hades did prevail (cf. Matthew 16:18). In IC.XC, Ramon They make The Holy Spirit sound like an absentee father. Here for a couple hundred years, then gone, then pops up again 1500 years.  |
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Post by Cepha on Jun 12, 2009 15:35:27 GMT -5
Answer the question I asked you before please. Second, for 1,000 years, there has only been ONE Church. It was called by various names, such as The Way, The Catholic Church, the One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church. I am not talking about the "Roman Catholic Church", a name given to the Western Apostolic Church after the Great Schism of 1054AD. Perhaps, it will be wise for you to research what the word "Catholic" originally meant. I am sick of death of people like you that say that somehow the Holy Spirit was present in the Apostolic Era, but then he left and came back 1,500 years later to enlighten some group of men. I am sick and tired of people like you that believe Christ did not guide his Church to all truth, because somehow, the Church as a whole, after the Holy Apostles death, got corrupted. I am sick to death of hearing that somehow the gates of Hades did prevail (cf. Matthew 16:18). In IC.XC, Ramon Why not? In the Old Testament few people were indwelt with the Holy Spirit. Same thing with Luther. Few people were indwelt with the Holy Spirit until Luthers time. God talks about having a remnant of true believers throughout both the Old and New Testament. Few people now or in the past have been true believers. The people who aren't true believers only have a form of godliness but deny the power. They are too busy with "bells and smells" to see the real meaning of the gospel. Where is this in The Bible? Wow. You're history is soooo backwards. Actually, the schism came "before" The First Crusade (which is when the Patrioch sent word to his brother in Christ requesting help and we went there to wipe the map free of those incurging Muslims who were going to attack our brothers). That's what started The Crusades...The Roman Church going to the aide of The Orthodox Church. Where do you get your history from Alfie? www.CatholicHatred.com?LOL! Question: How many Methodists died defending Christianity during The Crusades?  (Ramon falls off of his chair laughing at my question) What? R U kidding me! LMCBO! The Great Schism came 600 years AFTER Constantine! And the hardest LOL is for the Reformation was needed put a stop to it! Do you know who The Reformers were? Tell you this, they weren't Protestants! LOL! They were Catholics who wanted to "re-form" The Catholic Church (not create a new one) and the only thing they ended up doing was falling apart and fighting amongst themselves as their leaders (Luther, Calvin & Zwingly) created Armies to fight themselves! Wow. Alfie, you really need to hit Wikipedia more often.  |
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Post by teresahrc on Jun 13, 2009 14:36:11 GMT -5
 You have no idea what you are talking about! Sorry, but I don't know how else to answer that one. If Luther was so awesome, why was his final book that he wrote called...... "On the Jews and Their Lies (German: Von den Jüden und iren Lügen; in modern spelling Von den Juden und ihren Lügen) is a 65,000-word treatise written by German Reformation leader Martin Luther in 1543.
In the treatise, Luther writes that the Jews are a "base, whoring people, that is, no people of God, and their boast of lineage, circumcision, and law must be accounted as filth."[1] Luther wrote that they are "full of the devil's feces ... which they wallow in like swine,"[2] and the synagogue is an "incorrigible whore and an evil slut".[3] He argues that their synagogues and schools be set on fire, their prayer books destroyed, rabbis forbidden to preach, homes razed, and property and money confiscated. They should be shown no mercy or kindness,[4] afforded no legal protection,[5] and these "poisonous envenomed worms" should be drafted into forced labor or expelled for all time.[6] He also seems to advocate their murder, writing "[w]e are at fault in not slaying them."[7] en.wikipedia.org/wiki/On_the_Jews_and_Their_Lies
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Post by alfie on Jun 13, 2009 16:06:13 GMT -5
The ECFS wrote in a number of languages. There is Syriac, Latin, a Greek, Hebrew, and a number of other obscure languages that some of them are written in. You mean all of these guys with so many different languages (especially the obscure ones) were hanging out with the Apostles? What do you think the gift of "tounges" is? It's the ability for The Apostles to communicate to others in their own language. The Catholic Church claims that tounges ceased after pentecost so how would the ECFs be using tounges to communicate with each other? Besides tounges is used mostly to praise and worship God in church and not to make doctrine for the church. Again, you have no proof that the ECFs were students of the Apostles. |
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Post by alfie on Jun 13, 2009 16:16:28 GMT -5
You have no idea what you are talking about! Sorry, but I don't know how else to answer that one. If Luther was so awesome, why was his final book that he wrote called...... "On the Jews and Their Lies (German: Von den Jüden und iren Lügen; in modern spelling Von den Juden und ihren Lügen) is a 65,000-word treatise written by German Reformation leader Martin Luther in 1543.
In the treatise, Luther writes that the Jews are a "base, whoring people, that is, no people of God, and their boast of lineage, circumcision, and law must be accounted as filth."[1] Luther wrote that they are "full of the devil's feces ... which they wallow in like swine,"[2] and the synagogue is an "incorrigible whore and an evil slut".[3] He argues that their synagogues and schools be set on fire, their prayer books destroyed, rabbis forbidden to preach, homes razed, and property and money confiscated. They should be shown no mercy or kindness,[4] afforded no legal protection,[5] and these "poisonous envenomed worms" should be drafted into forced labor or expelled for all time.[6] He also seems to advocate their murder, writing "[w]e are at fault in not slaying them."[7] en.wikipedia.org/wiki/On_the_Jews_and_Their_Lies I showed you quotes in another post that proved the ECFs were anti-semitic so I am sure some of Luther's anti-semitism was learned from his Catholic background. But alas you choose to ignor that because of your bias. In the Old Testament David and other godly people were indwelt with the Holy Spirit. When Catholicism became the dominate religion people really didn't know about the in-dwelling of the Spirit. After the Reformation the common man was taught that he could be indwelt with the Spirit. And if he wasn't taught that in church he could read about the indwelling in the Bible. |
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