Post by kathleenelsie on Feb 5, 2009 14:12:58 GMT -5
(sending more toops to Afghanistan?),
Afghanistan is considered a "just war" by The Catholic Church, so yeah, send our boys there to get Bin Ladin (something Bush failed miserably at doing and even said didn't concern him much!). The Catholic Church has not declared the conflict JUST. The Catholic Church has stated that we now need to fix what we have damaged in the Mid East.Whither Catholic Teaching?
Today Catholicism adheres to a rich theology of peace, of which the Just War is only part. With the 40th anniversary of Pacem in Terris, time has come to draw the various pieces of this teaching into a coherent teaching on peace and war. The positive elements of the teaching—the defense of human rights, the right to integral human development, support for international law and global institutions as well as the relatively new teaching on nonviolence and forgiveness—need clearer articulation, so they can serve as a platform for a positive pastoral program for peace.
More can be found here. Also Pope John Paul II never formally declared any conflict unjust or just just gave his personal opinion and made sure this was understood. Read the information given. Historicly speaking wars have been declared just or unjust after they were ended.
www.regis.edu/content/alum/pdf/Catholicism%20in%20the%20News%20Vol%201%20number%205.pdf
What response?
fideidefensor.proboards80.com/index.cgi?board=politicaldiscussions&action=post&thread=470"e=7970&page=6
The statements that his stand was weak.
"It seems that Obama is trying to repeat the same mistakes that [former US president] George Bush made"
Osama Hamdan, a Hamas spokesman, told Al Jazeera that Obama's remarks seemed to show that the US viewed the situation through "Israeli eyes".
"It seems that Obama is trying to repeat the same mistakes that George Bush made without taking into consideration Bush's experience that resulted in the explosion of the region instead of reaching stability and peace in it," he said.
"I think this is an unfortunate start for President Obama in the region and the Middle East issue. And it looks like the next four years, if it continues with the same tone, will be a total failure."
Hey! We have another goat here! INSULT TAKEN PERSONALLY
Leave the starving hungry!
Give a credible site for this stand please.
As from my family and I we work the hunger garden, food bank and other personal things to help those in need.
Not singularly, but literally all of the issues were to be weighed.
The Church even literally stated that you couldn't vote for a Pro-Life candidate who was wrong on other issues.
(so you voted for one that has now made abortion available and paidfor by us world wide)
Ahhh...again, read what the Church said...I voted for Obama's Church approved policies, not for his Church dissapproved policies.
Get it right.
(so again you voted in someone that promised to make it more available and easier to get?)
No...I voted for the candidate who was closer to The Church in every other stance.
(Is there an echo in here? LOL )
(and even again I say you knowingly voted for the one you knew he would do as he said he did not lie he will enable many many more women to murder their children)
Again, you really need to read the document on what The Church teaches...This isn't the church of Kathleene.
Sorry, but it's not up to you.
No it is up to Holy Mother Church.
Recently (7/7/04), then Cardinal Ratzinger of the Vatican, now Pope Benedict XVI, sent a message to all Bishops stating that politicians who support abortion should be denied Holy Communion. If the Church denies them Communion, shouldn't we as Catholics deny them our vote too?
Bend your belief to what The Church teaches;
don't try to bend what The Church teaches to your belief limitations.
Good advice for each person that says they are Catholoc oor catholic.
(yes and you still supported him this makes you doing it with full knowledge of the murders to take place in the name of choice)
Now you are slandering me and lieing about me.
No you stated you voted for BHO. And the fact is that he is the most pro-abortion POTUS ever to run for POTUS. Simple fact.
I never supported him on abortion.
Keep telling yourself this. No matter the reasoning behind the vote you still helped him get into office and expand the murder of the unborn.
You know something? You really should become an Anti-Catholic.
You have all their characteristics down.
You lie. WHERE give me Vatican proof of my lies as you call them.
But Jesus will judge you for that, just like He will judge me and my heart knowing exactly "why" I voted for Obama.
Here you speak truth. You will be judged just like the rest of us. God will know.
As for you?
Remember, when you get judged, be ready to hang a left!
Matthew 7 K...Matthew 7.
Which part?
7.1 This is not a prohibition against reconizing the faults of others, which could hardyl be compatible with vv 5 & 6 but against the spririt of arrigance, forgetful of ones own faults.
7.5...is here given to the Christian desciple who is concerned with the faults of another and ignores his/her own more serious faults.
7.6...He may have been taking this saying as applying to a Christian dealing with an obstinsibly imperitent fellow Christian.
I know that my vote was not perfect and I am a sinner in Gods eyes that no matter how hard I try I can never be good enough to deserve the salvation God has so willingly provided. I place my hope in only Him and his Mercy. I also know that God expects me to do all that I can to protect the live of His creation and not to make excuses for my personal decisions.
Curious, did you vote for a man that won't repeal Roe V Wade ever had he been elected and that supports a woman's right to choose an abortion if she feels like her health is more important that The Catholic Church's teaching and if she was raped or if incest was the case?
I voted for the person or persons that would not place liberal pro-death judges in the Supreme Court. I voted for the life of the un-born and those waiting to see the face of God at the end of their lives. I voted against the most anti-life persons that this country has ever seen.
Judging me by your own standards, what would that make you?
Oh wait, I forgot...The Lesser of Two Evils Voter.
Catholic Leadership Conference Releases Statement on Catholics and Voting
By Deacon Keith Fournier
9/16/2008
Catholic Online
"No prudential judgment can justify certain acts, such as direct abortion, euthanasia, and the killing of unborn life for medical research. These acts are intrinsically evil and violate the Natural Law."
CHARLOTTE, N.C. (Catholic Online) - On September 11th and 12th, a group of leaders of national Catholic organizations, missions, ministries, apostolates and institutions gathered in Charlotte, North Carolina for prayer, networking, strategic planning, informational and formative talks and panel discussions. The group, called “The Catholic leadership Conference”, was begun in 1998. Its stated mission “is to encourage cooperation and collaboration among national Catholic lay apostolates while providing venues for those leaders to exchange ideas, strengthen personal relationships and take unified action as desired.”
The CLC is composed of the heads of national Catholic organizations and “other known Catholics who are in a position of influence in business, education, science, politics and the arts and who are loyal to the teaching authority of the Roman Catholic Church.” The conference is held annually and is attended only by invitation. This year, in addition to the numerous lay leaders in attendance,two religious sisters,two Bishops, several priests and this deacon were also present. It was an extraordinary event packed with excellent presentations of great importance to Catholics who are dedicated to infusing the culture with the values informed by the Catholic Christian faith. The action taken by the Conference was equally important. The CLC unanimously passed the following statement concerning the obligations of Catholic voters as we approach the 2008 elections in the United States of America:
As Catholic voters, we acknowledge the following ten obligations and guidelines:
1. Catholics must participate in the political process and do so responsibly by being faithful citizens, informing the exercise of their citizenship by the teaching of their Church, and casting their votes in every election.
2. Catholics who vote should always be guided in their political participation by the moral and social teachings of the Catholic Church, especially those more strongly insisted upon by the Magisterium.
3. Catholics should recognize that not all moral and social issues have equal weight in determining how to cast their vote because there is a hierarchy of values and their application. Additionally, on some matters affecting public policy there is room for the exercise of individual prudential judgment.
4. On such prudential matters Catholics of goodwill can disagree, although all Catholics should be able to trace their reasoning back to the shared principles of Catholic moral and social teaching.
5. In regard to the “life issues,” no prudential judgment can justify certain acts, such as direct abortion, euthanasia, and the killing of unborn life for medical research. These acts are intrinsically evil and violate the Natural Law, since they always involve the direct and intentional taking of innocent human life. Such acts are always to be avoided and abhorred in positive law and public policy.
6. Catholic voters are morally obliged to make decisions about their vote based primarily on issues which admit of no prudential judgment, such as direct abortion, the obligation to protect marriage between a man and a woman, and the family as the first social institution.
7. Catholic voters should also take into account other important social issues which concern the common good, always seeking to properly inform their exercise of faithful citizenship with reference to the truths taught by the Catholic Church. In so doing, they should acknowledge that there is no single "Catholic" position on issues like immigration, taxes, education, and delivery of medical care, in the sense of a specific policy approach, which all Catholics must espouse. However, there are Catholic principles, such as the dignity of the human person and fundamental rights, which should always be considered. Those principles are set forth in the body of Church teaching referred to as the "Social Doctrine of the Catholic Church.”
8. The role of the Church and her official teachers is to instruct and to remind Catholic voters of the moral obligations and moral-social principles that should guide their exercise of faithful citizenship and voting. The Church does not intend to tell Catholic citizens for whom they should vote but seeks to help them understand the moral and social issues involved.
9. Catholics rightly insist that their voice be heard in the political process. They affirm that their positions on many seemingly purely political issues are properly informed by their faith and by the moral teachings of that faith. They further affirm that many of those positions are also found within the Natural Law, which is knowable through the exercise of reason and binding on all men and women. Finally, they assert that religious faith and its exercise, though personal, is never private, and its free exercise is guaranteed and protected by the founding documents of the American government.
10. Catholics recognize that while some matters enjoined upon them by their faith are not relevant to positive law or public policy, the moral and social teachings of the Catholic Church are, and the principles of these teachings can be directly applied by reasoned argument to public policy. These teachings should be publicly espoused in such a way that they can inform the making of positive law and public policy and must never be artificially limited to the private domain of individual belief.
A Cafetiria Catholic...pick and choose what's comfortable for you according to your personal standards...while you'll happily allow the poor to starve and the wars to continue and peace with our enemies to remain a dream.
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